InsectNet forum

adamcotton · by adamcotton » Wed May 29, 2024 5:45 pm

I must say Chuck is doing a great job trying to unravel what seems to be a very complex situation. This thread is really interesting, not only because of all the photos and data presented, but also the intrigue of getting to see all the issues as the data is accumulated. I am really looking forward to eventually finding out what the DNA results bring up and how they correlate with wing pattern differences. However, it may be necessary to include many more genes than COI before a clear picture starts to develop. Unfortunately that generally involves a large budget, unless adding only a few more genes produces better resolution. Certain groups of Papilionidae I have worked on just produce a jumbled mess using COI alone, whereas some actually produce good trees with high reliability. We can hope that the Tigers fall into the latter category.

Adam.

Chuck · by Chuck » Wed May 29, 2024 5:14 pm

29may24
64F/ 18C 50% cloud

After four days of heavy rain and storms I was surprised to see any Tigers. I almost caught a female who wouldn't leave a box elder tree, basking in the sun. After she left another arrived, looking for a place in the sun, when a third tiger arrived and off they went.

Observed 3, caught 0

Chuck · by Chuck » Wed May 29, 2024 3:44 pm

SPRING FORM in FINGER LAKES, NY

That there exists a Spring Form of "Papilio glaucus" (in quotes because that is undetermined) has long been recognized. According to Scriber, 1990 "Interaction of Introgressionfrom Papilio Glaucus Canadensis and Diapause in Producing "Spring Form" Eastern Tiger Swallowtail Butterflies, P. Glaucus" the Spring Form expresses canadensis traits due to interbreeding, traits which do not arise in the summer form.

In at least the Finger Lakes region of NY, Hagen & Lederhouse (1985) demonstrated that Spring Flight (which one must suppose is Spring Form, not canadensis) is univoltine- it does not lead to larvae which emerge as adults in the same year. I do not know whether Spring Form in VA and elsewhere is univoltine, though they look remarkably the same.

Male

Female

Some might say it looks like any old Tiger Swallowtail, which is of course not the case. Comparisons:

Larger than canadensis; smaller that nominate glaucus; about the size of small MST.

Wings more apexed than canadensis; HW not as elongated as MST. In this particular female, the wings are indeed apexed like MST.

Head tuft of hair between antennae like canadensis, but the black HW line alongside the abdomen isn't wide enough for canadensis; it is about the same as some MST.

FW verso submarginal yellow band unbroken or almost, like MST. HW verso black line separating yellow from dark is almost straight, more like canadensis and certainly like MST.

Yellow/ orange Lunules on HW verso are more square than glaucus, not close to canadensis, and not dissimilar to the variation of MST (compare the female to the male.)

Legs have been frozen for genetic analysis. I think "Spring Form" at least our Spring Form is not glaucus. We shall see.

Chuck · by Chuck » Tue May 28, 2024 1:52 pm

This "orange form" does pop up now and then. I'm guessing maybe 1 in 1000? I don't know what causes it, but they fly with normal polyxenes, so I'm guessing it's not environmental.

Chuck · by Chuck » Tue May 28, 2024 12:21 pm

Paul & Mothman55- your personal observations are invaluable, keep posting!

In "Butterflies of Viginia" 1953(?) Clark & Clark went off-topic and delved into many pages on forms and ranges and flight periods found throughout eastern North America. For the most part, there has been no significant effort to add to that study- most of what we know is by-product of specific study (e.g. the description of appalachiensis).

About Tigers in the Toronto area, both Wang and Schmidt have published papers that discuss the ranges of glaucus, canadensis, and MST, including maps. I've posted links in this thread somewhere in the past. They are, of course, not comprehensive, and the range of MST (at least) is fluid. But the Canadians do have a far better view of the range of the three taxa than can be found for NY or anywhere in NE USA.

So I'd urge everyone who's interested to offer observations of any sort concerning Tigers, and not just in the east, there are "issues" in the west, and in the US south.

.......................

25 May 2024 I went up near the Lake Ontario shoreline to search for small Tigers that I believe a hybrid between Spring Form and canadensis. Hiking through some real tough deciduous regrowth for hours I saw nothing. Only when I got back in the truck did I see one, flying high along the forest edge as they do. Then garbage weather came in, and continues through today 5/28.

Observed 1, captured 0.

eurytides · by eurytides » Mon May 27, 2024 6:22 am

I had an aberrant female a few years ago, also with heavier than typical black markings.

lamprima2 · by lamprima2 » Sun May 26, 2024 11:59 pm

The photo was taken from the pupa of Agrius convolvuli.

mothman55 · by mothman55 » Sun May 26, 2024 10:45 pm

Yes, she is on the spreading board now. Just as I was about to sweep the net, a male came and chased her to the other side of this huge lilac stand.I had to search for a few minutes as there were many males around. Finally found her again and made no mistake this time.

Trehopr1 · by Trehopr1 » Sun May 26, 2024 7:56 pm

Absolutely incredible female !!

I do hope you were able to catch that one before it flew away.....

Trehopr1 · by Trehopr1 » Sun May 26, 2024 7:54 pm

That's quite an incredible capture of a VERY unique female.

I have never seen anything quite like that in all my life !

wollastoni · by wollastoni » Sun May 26, 2024 1:17 pm

Erora laeta has a wonderful underside ! Thank you for sharing !

wollastoni · by wollastoni » Sun May 26, 2024 1:14 pm

Wonderful ! Thank you for sharing.

lamprima2 · by lamprima2 » Sun May 26, 2024 4:09 am

A while ago, I asked Insectnet members if something was published on the
structure and function of Sphinginae pupae's maxillary loops (aka "jug handle”). There was no reply. I contacted a few specialists in this area. One of them replied: "If you would look inside, you will see that the galeae extend from the head into the loop, then the galeae bend sharply back and turn back to the head of the pupae. On the pupae, you can see the distal part of the developing galeae in the midline of the pupae between the developing wings." I spent some time trying to find something illustrating this observation and finally found this amazing photograph by M. Albrecht (from Danner et al., “Die Schwarmer der westlichen Palearktis,” Herbipoliana, Band 4/2, 1998, Plate 46).

: Agrias convulvuli pupa proboscis copy.jpg (275.39 KiB) Viewed 182 times

Boertje · by Boertje » Sun May 26, 2024 3:40 am

Hi Adam

Thank you very much for the extensive information. Much appreciated!

Best regards
B

Paul K · by Paul K » Sat May 25, 2024 8:17 pm

That female looks awesome!!
I only saw males and despite lilacs in full bloom I wasn’t able to spot a female. I’m still missing a female of this species leaving in Canada for over 3 decades. I suppose I did not make enough effort.

mothman55 · by mothman55 » Sat May 25, 2024 6:39 pm

One of the more difficult hairstreaks to find is the early hairstreak (Erora laeta), rarely found and only in May in this area (Central Ontario). I was fortunate again this year to find a female, here are a couple of pics. Also an aberrant silvery blue (Glaucopsyche lygdamus), note

: PXL_20240515_223743046~2.jpg (487.24 KiB) Viewed 120 times

: PXL_20240515_230236769~3.jpg (561.09 KiB) Viewed 120 times

: PXL_20240523_222558580.MP.jpg (749.25 KiB) Viewed 120 times

the absence of the usual spots on the ventral side. Its a female.

mothman55 · by mothman55 » Sat May 25, 2024 6:31 pm

In the previous post, the elfins in order are hoary, brown, and bog. The two that follow here are eastern pine and henry's.

: DSCF7582.JPG (529.78 KiB) Viewed 102 times

: DSCF7598.JPG (210.42 KiB) Viewed 102 times

mothman55 · by mothman55 » Sat May 25, 2024 6:28 pm

Early this May is the time for elfins in Central Ontario. But this year was a great year for these little brown critters. There are five species in this area, and four of the five were as numerous as I have ever seen. The more rare one in the group, the bog elfin (Callophrys lanoraieensis) was also seen in multiple bogs this year, and I was fortunate to see my first ones. The other four species, brown (C. augustinus), hoary (C. polios), henry's (C. henrici), and eastern pine (C. niphon) were found in mass all over central Ontario. In my favourite elfin spot, I saw well over 100 elfins in a 3 hour period. Here

: DSCF7497.JPG (598.84 KiB) Viewed 103 times

: DSCF7503.JPG (593.69 KiB) Viewed 103 times

: DSCF7581.JPG (553.51 KiB) Viewed 103 times

are a few elfin pics from a couple of weeks ago.

kevinkk · by kevinkk » Sat May 25, 2024 6:24 pm

I had to look at the polyxenes I raised a few years ago from Ohio stock. Your butterfly has more orange, my specimens have smaller orange eyespots and no orange on the border.

mothman55 · by mothman55 » Sat May 25, 2024 6:17 pm

Yesterday while watching the lilacs for female Papilio canadensis north of Toronto, I got this interesting female polyxenes. It was the only one of this species I saw in amongst numerous P. canadensis, and in fact I see very few polyxenes in this area (Coe Hill, Ontario). Note the orange spots on the dorsal hindwings, certainly not typical, at least not around

: DSCF7688.JPG (608.14 KiB) Viewed 193 times

here.

InsectNet forum

InsectNet forum

Re: Tiger Swallowtails of NY: Finger Lakes, Part II

Re: Tiger Swallowtails of NY: Finger Lakes, Part II

Re: Tiger Swallowtails of NY: Finger Lakes, Part II

Re: Unique papilio polyxenes

Re: Tiger Swallowtails of NY: Finger Lakes, Part II

Re: Tiger Swallowtails of NY: Finger Lakes, Part II

Re: "Proboscis case" in Sphingidae pupae (continuation)

Re: Tiger Swallowtails of NY: Finger Lakes, Part II

Re: Tiger Swallowtails of NY: Finger Lakes, Part II

Re: Unique papilio polyxenes

Re: Love hairstreaks and blues

Re: "Proboscis case" in Sphingidae pupae (continuation)

"Proboscis case" in Sphingidae pupae (continuation)

Re: Can someone please identify regular housequest?

Re: Tiger Swallowtails of NY: Finger Lakes, Part II

Love hairstreaks and blues

Re: A great year for elfins

A great year for elfins

Re: Unique papilio polyxenes

Unique papilio polyxenes