InsectNet forum

entomologist · by entomologist » Sat Jun 03, 2023 7:39 pm

AKcolias, here is your video.

AKColias · by AKColias » Sat Jun 03, 2023 2:57 pm

wollastoni wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:19 am Impressive !
But I would be afraid to damage some scales or to have vein marks.

One aesthetic advice : put the HW a little bit lower like this one from Bicbugs
Luehdorfia-japonica.jpg

I prefer pulling the hindwing up more, aesthetically. But for species with tails, I make sure the tails do not stick out to the sides past the width of the forewing, as that increases the chance of damage; and for a few species that area needs to be visible to show a feature.

AKColias · by AKColias » Sat Jun 03, 2023 2:53 pm

entomologist, would you consider making a video of your pinning methods? I am sure both the shingling and the pinning multiple specimens under a single paper would be of interest to many people. Personally, I do shingle sometimes, but I always use a separate strip of paper for each wing...clearly your method would be faster.

bobw · by bobw » Sat Jun 03, 2023 9:45 am

Having studied Colias for many years I've always left a big gap between forewing and hindwing, as the males of some species have a sex brand along the dorsal hindwing costa, which is diagnostic. Not as much as Adam's Japanese set stockleyi, which looks a bit weird, but I find it equally unappealing when the forewing covers a large part of the hindwing.

adamcotton · by adamcotton » Sat Jun 03, 2023 8:48 am

These are 'good guys', they eat the pests on the Citrus plants.

Adam.

adamcotton · by adamcotton » Sat Jun 03, 2023 8:34 am

Indeed, some groups need to be spread that way.

Adam.

Cabintom · by Cabintom » Sat Jun 03, 2023 7:55 am

Bear in mind that there are genera (Neptis for example) which can have diagnostic characters along the ventral FW inner margin or dorsal HW costa. If HWs are set to high up, those features are obstructed rendering specific ID difficult.

boghaunter1 · by boghaunter1 » Sat Jun 03, 2023 12:27 am

Me too!.... I absolutely cringe when I see beautiful/rare spp. with "drooping" hindwings (huge unsightly gap/V between fore & hindwings)... I call it "crucifixion" style when specimens are mounted in an over stretched/sprawled out "X" shape. Over the years I've read in many books that there should be a small "V" between the wings making a smooth transition from fore to hindwings. I also cringe when I see Sphinx moths mounted with the forewings angled up greater than a 90 degree right angle to the body. There are, however, some spp. (some Swallowtails, Parnassians & many of the Birdwings) that look better with a larger gap between the wings. In the end it is, of course, a personal choice... each to their own... I will relax "crucifixion" mounted leps. & remount them whenever possible. I think a lot of these "big gap" specimens may be due to incomplete relaxing... as the hindwings in many leps. (especially old papered specimens) can remain very stiff despite plenty of time in the relaxing chamber. I have often used a sharp X-acto knife to cut the seized wing muscles to allow them to be pulled up more... also very helpful/often essential to mount up some skipper butterflies.

John K.

eurytides · by eurytides » Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:58 pm

Same here.

entomologist · by entomologist » Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:54 pm

I follow the same setting style as you Adam. I too dislike the “Japanese style.”

earthling · by earthling » Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:26 pm

Thanks, that is certainly it. We have a few invasive species out here, so when I see something odd, it goes in the ziploc. I put it outside and took a few more photos, it grew rather quickly during its two days in the bag, although it may also have lost some of its debris ball.

adamcotton · by adamcotton » Fri Jun 02, 2023 10:16 pm

wollastoni wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:19 am One aesthetic advice : put the HW a little bit lower like this one from Bicbugs

This is not bad, but I don't like the appearance of specimens set with hindwings pointing downwards, sometimes called 'Japanese style'.

Here are 2 spring form Papilio bianor stockleyi, the top one spread by Prasobsuk Sukkit and the lower one spread by me from a papered specimen he gave me:

: stockleyi spreading comparison.jpg (544.5 KiB) Viewed 140 times

Adam.

livingplanet3 · by livingplanet3 » Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:25 pm

It's the larva of a Green Lacewing, which carries debris as camouflage / protection -

https://extension.sdstate.edu/green-lac ... landscapes

https://bugguide.net/node/view/140

earthling · by earthling » Fri Jun 02, 2023 9:20 pm

I am usually pretty good with insect identification, but this one had me mystified. I stumbled onto it quite literally when I walked by a stack of lemons we received from a neighbor, and I noticed a piece of what appeared to be black debris that was moving. I stopped and watched it for a moment as it slowly crawled down the side of the lemon. When I leaned forward to look at it more closely, it froze (stopped moving). During the time I went to get my camera, it moved more, but had stopped moving again by the time I approached it to take a photo.

We are in the California desert, but the lemons came from a tree in the Long Beach/Los Angeles area. Entirely uncertain what I am looking at here, so I figured I would post it for identification. The photo shows two views, one as-photographed on left (arrows showing direction of movement) and a closer photo that has had its contrast enhanced. The night time photos were not ideal. Specimen has been bagged and boxed (with lemon) for later info.

Any suggestions appreciated.

entomologist · by entomologist » Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:25 pm

adamcotton wrote: ↑Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:19 am Yes, I do this too, although I leave a slightly larger gap between specimens. On a 60cm board I can normally fit about 10-12 large Papilios or 15+ smaller specimens like these.

Interestingly I pin the data on the right of each specimen rather than the left - personal preference I suppose.

Adam.

I can imagine with some of the long tailed papilionidae overlapping wings is almost a must.

entomologist · by entomologist » Fri Jun 02, 2023 8:22 pm

As mentioned by 58chevy, I have a specific style for spreading butterfly wings. Typically, I aim to align the forewing and hindwing margins to create a nearly rectangular shape. However, it's important to note that this technique may not work for all species due to their unique wing shapes. I appreciate your suggestion of positioning the Luehdorfia specimens, Wallastoni, and I will consider trying that approach with the additional specimens I have. Thank you for your input!

58chevy · by 58chevy » Fri Jun 02, 2023 7:21 pm

Wallastoni, I prefer the hindwings closer to the forewings, the way Entomologist does it. Lowering the hindwings makes the specimen look "droopy" to me. Each collector has his own preference. As far as I know, there's no "correct" way to mount the specimens. I would be interested in seeing a poll of Insectnet members to see what percentage prefer "up" or "down".

KKarns · by KKarns » Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:20 pm

Never get tired of perusing beetle collections! Thanks for sharing my friend.

AKColias · by AKColias » Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:17 pm

Does anyone recognize this moth? It is similar to Orthosia hibisci but with less pattern on the wings. It is unusually common this spring in South Central Alaska, despite a generally poor spring for moths.

Partially_Mist76 · by Partially_Mist76 » Fri Jun 02, 2023 12:21 pm

Thanks!

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