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A couple older specimens from Tamaulipas, Mexico. Not mine. These were "cherry picked" for the photo, being larger and with more expressive colors.

Outstanding chuck !
Anyone can own beaters or specimens half as good
but, getting your hands on specimens like that (these days) is expensive and unlikely to happen even if you wanted to try and catch your own.
Fantastic species...

A lovely Swallowtail Chuck. Nice to see some Mexican specimens.I managed to get some specimens from Ken Thorne in Canada a few years back. Ex pupae from El Salvador. This species was available as livestock here in the U.K. a while back. Certainly as pupae & possibly as larvae. Can't remember properly. Did not take advantage myself anyway.

Trehopr1 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 24, 2023 3:30 pm Outstanding chuck !
Anyone can own beaters or specimens half as good
but, getting your hands on specimens like that (these days) is expensive and unlikely to happen even if you wanted to try and catch your own.
Fantastic species...

Those specimens pictured are part of a well known institutional collection. Not all of them are in such perfect condition; not that it matters, it's for research, not art. I'd bet I could cut them a trade for those specimens, but what good are they to me? Just more I have to care for.

I wouldn't even know who has "beater" pilumnus for sale. I suppose even for collectors, beat is better than nothing. Those specimens I pictured are fabulous, but lest one forget, there's a story of someone's efforts behind those, they weren't picked up off the ground. And, they are a data point, potentially important, for changing ecosystems (i.e., ecological destruction.) I think their value far exceeds that of just another perfect specimen...anyone can buy a perfect new 2022 Mustang GT, but I'd rather experience the 1969 Fastback with a bit of wear and tear. Some of my non-entomological collection is pricey; the price of a pair of Ornithoptera Alexandrae doesn't shock me. So collectibles and money are all relative.

daveuk wrote: ↑Tue Jan 24, 2023 5:14 pm ...I managed to get some specimens from Ken Thorne in Canada a few years back. Ex pupae from El Salvador...

Outstanding specimens! Is this a pair?

livingplanet3 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 24, 2023 7:41 pm

Outstanding specimens! Is this a pair?
[/quote]

Yes. Male top photo. Female bottom photo.

Well to each his own Chuck. I was just being complimentary of a fine pair of swallowtails which you were kind enough to show us.

Believe it or not, there was a time I would bet those specimens were not "research" oriented specimens. I would even go further to say that the institution that now houses them most likely did not collect them.

Most likely they were the property of a private collector (just like myself) who happened to have an eye for nice specimens and who probably purchased them. Even if he had caught them himself he would have been a mighty lucky individual but, it happens....

As is the case in many institutional collections private individuals over the years may sell or donate their collections and get a tax write-off; this is most often done when the collector falls into ill health or old age.

I take offense to people who see my passion in natural history as some "artsy" endeavor.... I have had a passionate appreciation of insect life since I was 5 years old and my endearing desire to capture, collect, record and retain specimens has always fulfilled my life in a way nothing else ever has short of the love of my family.

The only reason I don't harbor (much less than perfect specimens) is because I value the drawer space and expense as paramount to a worthy specimen.

I can fully say that over 90% of anything I own has good data along with it. Enough, that any possible institution (down the road) would not see this effort as an exercise in artwork folly.

Trehopr1 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 24, 2023 9:47 pm
Most likely they were the property of a private collector (just like myself) who happened to have an eye for nice specimens and who probably purchased them. Even if he had caught them himself he would have been a mighty lucky individual but, it happens....


The only reason I don't harbor (much less than perfect specimens) is because I value the drawer space and expense as paramount to a worthy specimen.

The series of pilumnus in the institutional collection were obtained in the field by several lepidopterists long associated with the institution.


I agree that with collectibles, it's better to have one star piece than 20 generic / common. That said, one need not denigrate imperfect specimens, as not everyone can afford the top items; imperfect specimens are not unworthy, nor or those who must, or elect to, procure less than perfect specimens.