Perhaps, lamprima2 just let it "fix" itself for a little while in the 90% alcohol and then put a pin in it and let it dry.

The older cuticle of the pupal case should be thick enough and strong enough to be just fine and in time the insides will dry out and harden.

Then you can have your pinned.specimen.

Trehopr1 and jhyatt,
Thank you for your replies.
I did exchange the alcohol solution a few times until it became clear.
There is no problem storing any specimens in alcohol,
however, my goal was to preserve dried specimens.
I do not have freeze-drying equipment.

Hello Tim !

Your questions are INDEED well founded. I do not agree with the relative "ease" that some members bandy-about when it comes to doing a foreign trip these days !

This is NOT the 1970s, 1980s, or 1990s when travel abroad was VERY different. The world has changed exponentially in the 2000s. Dare I even mention how security has changed since 9/11/2001. Tie in customs with that statement as well. The costs overall from Air flights to lodging as well as any vehicle travel needed/involved is hefty ANY way you look at it.

I could go on and on and it is simply a logistical mess if you ask me ! The only country that I can even think of in South America which welcomes collectors is French Guiana. There are some folks here that have been there and have learned what places offer such packages and accommodations. They could further tell you what sort of documents you might need to leave with your specimens or how you might get them into the US. Our forum owner Olivier and forum member Paul k are two that I know offhand to ask.

Aside from French Guiana I don't know of ANY other Central or South American country which offers anything of the like. Many are just plain unsafe due to the drug trade, kidnappings of foreigners, robbery, or general unrest due to unsavory politics at work.

Maybe, having friends or family actually living in some foreign country may help you at least get there or at the very least make you feel safer because they know the area they live in. However, it still doesn't explain away how you would get bait traps, a generator, or even any access to the "wild places" where real collecting can still be found.

The bottom line is unless you can make contact with someone experienced OR a travel service offering such excursions (who can make all of the necessary arrangements); then don't try doing it yourself....

This is 2024 and the world is far removed from what it once was.

I would also add that if you buy commercially (like most of us do) you will probably wind up with far better looking specimens than anything you might run into trying to collect it yourself ---- if you ever even find it at all !

Chuck wrote: ↑Sat Apr 06, 2024 9:45 pm Congratulations on finishing school! It's quite a bit of work and time.

My suggestion if I may- don't buy commercially, use that money to go there. You're young enough to learn to handle the hardships and maximize collecting efforts. Why buy one when you can catch ten?

It certainly would be awesome to collect some myself but I'm honestly not sure all that would entail. A few questions someone here may be able to answer:
1. I'm sure there are certain South American countries more friendly to collecting (not Brazil, lol), what are the best options?
2. How does one go about finding a collecting spot in a foreign country and a local connection?
3. What kind of import/export permits/paperwork would a collecting trip require. Do you ship your specimens back or carry them with you?
4. Is it better to travel with collecting equipment, or ship it there, or buy/make it there? I'm thinking of bait traps, lights and nets.
5. How safe would it be to embark on such a trip as a single individual?
6. For something like Agrias, how likely is it that you would even collect any while there?
The idea of collecting in Aouth America sounds great but obviously, I have endless logistical questions.

I would think that freeze-drying would be the best method to preserve large pupae, but of course you'd have to have the proper equipment to do it...
jh

Hello lamprima2,

Very sorry to hear that your experiment was disastrous. I was afraid that using any man-made solvents would severely dry out or damage the test subject.

This is why I suggested using 90% rubbing alcohol. At the museum where I worked for 8 years we stored many things in 70% alcohol but, we also stored other things in 90% to fix the tissues without necessarily drying them out.

I've never known 70% or 90% rubbing alcohol to damage anything. Yes, initially when you drop something in it there is an exchange of bodily fluids and rubbing alcohol and this is where you will see the rubbing alcohol change color. However, once you dump out the bad alcohol which has become discolored you refill it and check it again in a little while to see that it still remains clear.

Wishing you better luck next time if you have another test subject.

Update on large pupae processing:
Manduca sexta pupae were euthanized by freezing,
and stored in 80% ethanol for two months. The result was disastrous: upon drying, the pupae became covered with whitish flakes. It looks like the outer layer of the pupa's cuticle (epicuticle?) is peeled off. Next time I will simply pin the pupa and let it dry in the presence of CaCl2 or bury it in silica-gel, rather than exposing it to organic solvents.

Today April 7 I saw first P.rapae here in South/west Toronto. The spring is officially here and it is about two weeks earlier as we had very mild winter this year.

Papilio_indra wrote: ↑Sat Apr 06, 2024 9:57 pm This is an excellent treatment of Anthocharis by Todd Stout: https://digitalcommons.unl.edu/cgi/view ... sectamundi

It is indeed, thank you so much for the link

This is an excellent treatment of Anthocharis by Todd Stout: https://digitalcommons.unl.edu/cgi/view ... sectamundi

Congratulations on finishing school! It's quite a bit of work and time.

My suggestion if I may- don't buy commercially, use that money to go there. You're young enough to learn to handle the hardships and maximize collecting efforts. Why buy one when you can catch ten?

Paul-

iNaturalist tries to stay on top of systematics, but sometimes there can be a delay.

sara https://www.inaturalist.org/observations?taxon_id=59124

stella https://www.inaturalist.org/observation ... _id=900256

all Anthocheris julia https://www.inaturalist.org/observation ... _id=900255

Hi Paul,

Maybe contact Mikeh.
He seems to travel all over that region.
Probably one of the most knowledgeable Western collectors regarding where certain butterflies can be found.

Evra might know as well but, he seems to collect the more southerly portions of the West in much drier habitats. He is certainly very knowledgeable in that regard.

Does anyone know current systematic of this species?
Also if anyone knows good locality to collect it around eastern slope of Rocky Mountains south of Calgary.
As far as my research there should be A.stella inhabit some areas.

I have seen D.plexippus in Costa Rica and Dominican Republic. It does not occur in Thailand or Laos, at least not yet, most of subspecies other than N.American nominate don’t migrate.

Hello Tim !
Congratulations are in order for finishing up your schooling.

Very nice to see you once again posting some of your acquisitions. Have missed your presence here on the forum but, hope to see more of you here now as youthful collectors help to invigorate our forum !

A. narcissus is certainly a grand start in the genus and females of just about anything are just "icing on the cake" for one's collection.

Wish you well in your endeavors and do stay in touch with us here !

I'm entering a new phase in my collecting now that I am working full-time and out of school (YAY!). Currently, I'm expanding my South American Nymphalidae. I finally snagged my favorite species of butterfly of all time (Agrias narcissus) for a reasonable price. I also have some other nice Agrias on the way.

Agrias pericles aurantica f. trajanus - Female - Brazil


Agrias narcissus narcissus - Male - Brazil

Yes they will come to her assuming she calls and assuming there are males flying. Exactly what the pheromone is chemically is probably unknown and the exact flight time of the males might vary though. I've found that the males of the western Smerinthus fly really late, like 1-3 AM. Good luck. I would recommend trying along a river with lots of willows/aspens.

Pierre wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 7:19 pm Confirmed by Patrick Arnaud, organizator of this fair.

Thank you very much for the information Pierre.