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livingplanet3 · by livingplanet3 » Sat Nov 25, 2023 5:35 pm

Donation sent.

wollastoni · by wollastoni » Sat Nov 25, 2023 3:06 pm

Dear members,

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wollastoni · by wollastoni » Fri Nov 24, 2023 2:14 pm

Be careful, I had to remove another of these accounts in the Classifieds (Safman Rosicky).

I see they have "improved" their scam listing now some very rare species at high price (but affordable for the rarity) : https://reptileheaven.com/product/agria ... ournierae/ The real value of this pair would be at least $1,000.

I guess they steal pictures on the web of sold rarities and list them as if they have it. A simple google search about the rarity can lead you to their website.

KKarns · by KKarns » Tue Nov 21, 2023 9:15 pm

Wonderful species! Appreciate the post.

jhyatt · by jhyatt » Tue Nov 21, 2023 7:12 pm

Jshuey wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:21 pm The other thing to ponder, this stuff is not good for you. It can cause neurological damage. My bug room is pretty small, so I use it as sparingly as possible.

John

Yep, it's a cholinesterase inhibitor. My bug room is a roughly 60' X 40' open basement, fairly well ventilated, and I don't spend huge amounts of time there. Still, it's a concern. Paradichlorobenzene also can produce neurological effects. PDCB is more volatile than dichlorvos and needs replacement much more often, so I've switched to dichlorvos. But I think I will follow Shuey in using smaller pieces than I have been.

It's a dilemma; I can see why big museums have gone over to watching and freezing when infestations occur. But without a really big freezer, that's impractical at home.

jh

mothman55 · by mothman55 » Tue Nov 21, 2023 5:45 pm

Agree with Jshuey, as I keep my roughly 80 drawers in my basement. I would be concerned that 80 chunks of no pest strip might be a health concern for family that spends lots of time in the basement, obviously not in the room with the bugs, but what's to keep it confined to that particular room. I used to use moth crystals, but my wife put a stop to that many years ago as any time she went near the "moth room" as we call it, she could smell it, and its not safe either. So now for the past few years I am using cedar oil, not in the drawers, but in cabinets and about the room. I soak cedar disks in cedar oil, and place them around the drawers in the room. The cedar smell is rather pleasant, and diminishes after a day or two after treatment. I repeat this about every 2 or 3 months. So far no pests, but I know cedar oil will not kill the pests, only deter them, so I check my most valuable specimens routinely, just a flashlight to look under the bodies for any dust.

EdTomologist · by EdTomologist » Tue Nov 21, 2023 4:41 pm

Just commenting on the first reference to “tungstate injections”

As someone who wrote their thesis on the topic of wing development signaling, tungstate is mainly effective for nymphalids and certain groups of butterflies. It’s less toxic than other compounds and easily accessible. This makes it a good and easy option for producing aberrations.

There are in reality numerous compounds that induce aberrations through different mechanisms. Some of them mimic stress responses that result in darker wings. It’s a common immune response in insects to produce melanin.

There are also variable patterns that can be induced depending on the stage of injection.

I have been working with a new compound that can actually lighten the wings instead of darken them.

Given that my work is still to be published I don’t want to reveal too much. I also do have a concern regarding individuals using my work to sell man made aberrations but I believe it’s more important to have knowledge freely accessible.

I should also note that unlike tungstate where the mechanism of action (how it works) is unknown, a lot of other compounds we know exactly how they act. The main difference between compounds is their toxicity, the cost, and the difficulty in acquiring the compounds (must have scientific institutional purchase accounts).

Below is an artificial aberration from my research a while back plus link to other pictures.

[media] https://x.com/edtomologist/status/17270 ... UjOYW-YQdw[/media]

Jshuey · by Jshuey » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:21 pm

The other thing to ponder, this stuff is not good for you. It can cause neurological damage. My bug room is pretty small, so I use it as sparingly as possible.

John

jhyatt · by jhyatt » Tue Nov 21, 2023 3:07 pm

Paul K wrote: ↑Tue Nov 21, 2023 1:36 am In some of my drawers I haven’t change them since I started using these in 2015-16. They are pale yellow but so far no pests, I’m not sure if they still do work or I have no pest in my room.

Of course the usable lifetime may vary from drawer to drawer, depending on the rate of air exchange inside the particular drawer. I renewed all of mine about 1 year ago; I guess I'll let them go at least another year, or 2 or 3, unless I find an infestation... and I'll replace it in any drawers where I notice an unusually pale chunk of dichlorvos strip. I suspect there's no valid general answer to my original question.

jh

Jshuey · by Jshuey » Tue Nov 21, 2023 2:02 pm

I put little squares of dichlorvos in about three years ago. And I just saw a dermestid last month. So - about 2+ years? Or less - I assume that you get some time after the strips quit working - right? I use smaller squares than you do - more like 1/4th inch.

I'll be renewing it all over the long weekend this week.

John

teinopalpus · by teinopalpus » Tue Nov 21, 2023 9:26 am

Interesting topic. And not easy one .... abberants catched in nature and "created" by chemical injections or gene manipulation are far ends of whole spectrum. I personally never tried doing aberrants by use of chemicals ( although know process ), but several times "created" abberants "old way" by use of changed humidity or temperature. For some species it is easier way than chemical because some species are very negatively responsive to chemical agents. On other side some species are almost impossible to change without chemicals. But .... artifical use of natural factors is something in between far ends. Then we have also simple rearing specimens in different conditions. In my case usually valid for mountain species reared in my home at 400m atitude. Some species did not change, but some species are more plastic and little changes are visible.
And then .. sorry I cant skip that ... climatic change. Species are moving to new places , also on same place weather is changing and dramatic weather anomalies are present frequently and surely phenotype will react to changed conditions.

So as for me - as long as specimen has correct label information with all relevant data, it is OK. And it is only decision of collector if he find value of such specimen for his study/collection.

Jan

Paul K · by Paul K » Tue Nov 21, 2023 1:36 am

In some of my drawers I haven’t change them since I started using these in 2015-16. They are pale yellow but so far no pests, I’m not sure if they still do work or I have no pest in my room.

jhyatt · by jhyatt » Mon Nov 20, 2023 8:53 pm

I use dichlorvos strips ("No-pest strips") in my lep collection. I cut the large yellow slabs one can purchase into roughly 1/2" squares and pin one in each Cornell drawer. This seems to work well - I've had no infestations since I started using this material years and years ago.

But I wonder how one can tell when the fumigant is exhausted and should be replaced. I've been doing this when the originally deep yellow squares fade to a very pale yellow color. This takes about 3-4 years in a drawer of average tightness, in my experience.

Am I being risky and should be replacing them more often? Or am I leaving money on the table by replacing them too frequently? Does anyone have any actual data on the useful lifetime of dichlorvos strips?

Cheers,
jh

adamcotton · by adamcotton » Mon Nov 20, 2023 8:34 pm

There is some discussion whether a new taxon based purely on COI sequence constitutes 'description in words' under the ICZN Code or not when naming it. Some argue that the letters are abbreviations of words, whereas others say these alone should not count as a description 'in words'.

I think it is desirable to find morphological as well as sequence differences when naming something.

Adam.

livingplanet3 · by livingplanet3 » Mon Nov 20, 2023 6:53 pm

Twotails wrote: ↑Mon Nov 20, 2023 6:48 pm Hi, Anyone know what this is. Realise image is a bit blurry and hopefully I have attached it to this message....

It's the caterpillar of a geometrid moth, commonly called an "inchworm" -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geometer_moth

https://bugguide.net/node/view/188

These caterpillars usually mimic twigs of the plants they feed on, to conceal themselves from predators such as birds.

Twotails · by Twotails » Mon Nov 20, 2023 6:48 pm

Hi, Anyone know what this is. Realise image is a bit blurry and hopefully I have attached it to this message.

Chuck · by Chuck » Mon Nov 20, 2023 6:42 pm

Cabintom wrote: ↑Mon Nov 20, 2023 1:57 pm If you consistently see a, say, 1.2 or 1.3% difference between the barcodes of specimens from two populations (or forms, or what-have-you) and there are no barcodes "filling the gap", you likely have two separate species on your hands.

Given that one could well argue that COI is better at differentiation than morphological comparisions it seems this gap is more reliable. Given that, I've read several papers lately that show COI for broad-ranging taxa that are broken into clades (or some such) and so long as it exceeds 1.2% (or pick a number) then Joe Anybody could jump and describe dozens of new species based on the gap alone.

58chevy · by 58chevy » Mon Nov 20, 2023 5:54 pm

More...

58chevy · by 58chevy » Mon Nov 20, 2023 5:51 pm

These are not recent captures, but I thought I'd throw in a few more cerambycids after seeing Mike H's call for more beetles. All are from USA, mostly TX, AZ, FL. If you're interested in IDs, let me know & I'll post them after Thanksgiving.

Cabintom · by Cabintom » Mon Nov 20, 2023 1:57 pm

With COI, I like the concept of "barcode gap". If you consistently see a, say, 1.2 or 1.3% difference between the barcodes of specimens from two populations (or forms, or what-have-you) and there are no barcodes "filling the gap", you likely have two separate species on your hands. Personally, I'd also want to support the barcode hypothesis with concrete morphological and/or biogeographical evidence.

I also like Klee Diagrams, but that may be because I'm not so interested in proposed evolutionary lineages (and as Adam has pointed out, sometimes the different trees conflict with each other) and more interested in evidence supporting the existence of separate species.

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